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Accurate Rlm 70 & 71 Paint


tom
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I have been using Humbrol paint for the RLM 70 & 71. Seeing humbrol is hard to get i been been looking for a replacement paint. What I have found so far is not very accurate. I paint in enamels and Model master's RLM 70 & 71 have to much of a contrast between the two colors. I have looked a acrylics and they all the same problem as MM the DunkelGrun is way to light and two much of a contrast between it and the schwarzgrun.

It seems to be the trend in modeling lately is more toward how well a model is built and not to much toward accuracy, for example the over emphasized panel lines.

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Tom:

 

Your right about the acuracy and that is purposeful. Its all about the fun for most. Hence, accuracy is not a judging criteria

 

As for the paint, I like Xtracolor enamels- available form several stateside companies and in gloss. Next to that- Gunze

 

Dave

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I have the 3-ring binder book on Luftwaffe colors, complete with color chips. Lots of useful info on the colors and a VERY interesting write up on "scale" colors. To oversimplify it; you need to lighten all of your colors according to the scale you're building; and the smaller the scale, the lighter the colors.

 

It has to do with the contrast issue that you mentioned. When you look at the real thing in 1-1 scale, the colors are spread out over a wide area and don't look as "vibrant". When you put those same colors on a smaller object, they tend to be too vibrant and contrast too much because your viewing them over a smaller area. You look at a pic of the real thing and you look at your model and they're just not the same; DESPITE starting with accurate colors!

 

The book recommends lightening each color by about 25% on average. However, darker colors will show changes in hue easier than lighter colors, so you'd probably actually need to add less to dark colors than light ones to obtain a visual difference. You can use white or very light gray to do the lightening depending on your preference.

 

I can't speak to the absolute accuracy of MM colors vs. Humbrol vs. anyone elses. Besides, the REAL Lufwaffe colors varied slightly from batch to batch (as our own camo colors did) and I'm sure that's true (to a lesser degree) for hobby color batches. "Accurate" color is a real can of worms and VERY debatable. As I said above, scale appearance plays a large part in perceived accuracy, and I haven't even gotten into the effects of weathering on the finish! The idea is to start with a color that puts you in the ballpark. You can then adjust it to fit your personal perception.

 

I won't repeat my rant on accuracy here; you can go to the Aircraft heading and read it under the P-51 Colors topic question. It doesn't matter how you get to an RLM-72 that YOU like. You can start with an over the counter version or mix it yourself. I've just tried to point out reasons why something may not look the way you think it should right out of the bottle, when in actuallity it's probably closer than you think.

 

In the end, I think the best guideline is: If it looks right- it IS right! If you're not satisfied with what you've found so far, experiment with IT before tossing it aside. You may be able make it work for you. Also, keep in mind what is easily obtainable for you. That (hopefully) is what you can make useful so you don't have to worry about a supply of a certain brand being dropped locally. I wish I could recommned a brand that has a rep for being perfect right out of the bottle, but I've heard criticism of EVERY brand from one builder or another, depending on their perception! Best of luck!

 

GIL :smiley16:

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I am not trying to open a can of worms here, but, our models are supposed to be scale representations of the real thing. If it wasn't an important issue to a lot of modelers there wouldn't all the after market stuff to correct inaccuracies. There wouldn't be debates on forums, especially WWI forums, over correct colors of markings or lozenge fabric colors. I know the key thing is to enjoy the hobby, whether you build out of the box and don't worry about seams or you add every after market detail you can to your model that you can find. Reviewers will always discuss the accuracy of the kit. If your interested about that why not the correct colors. i am tired of hearing the line that the paint batches were different. Yes the were but not by great amounts of difference. You only notice the difference when you to different batches side by side.

 

I have been using Humbrol paints for years and when I use RLM 70 & 71 the contrast isn't any greater than the real 1 to 1 plane. So, I disagree with you there Gil.

We add details to models that wouldn't be seen at real distances of the 1 to 1 object, but we know they are supposed to be there, so our brain tells us it doesn't look right if we can't see it. When we look into a models cockpit, lets say a 1/72, and we don't see the instruments, switches and throttles, etc. it looks empty.

I will end this on the note that I personally want my models to be accurate and I don't mean every little detail added, I mean the detail that is there, the shape and colors. A friend of mine built his models without filling the seams and just followed what was in the instructions for painting. I had no problems with his models. I say to each his own.

 

 

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Bob- sure- no problem.

 

Tom- under stand your thoughts and there is a group similar to yourself. From what I have seen at clubs, etc, the majority build for fun and accuracy is not real important. That's reason people can complain about things like Dragons 1/32 P-51 and yet it still sells fine. Bottom line is to each his (or her) own and that'sd what makes it fun. For me, accuracy is nothing big. If it looks close, that's good enough. I guess the thing for me is not whether the relief tube is correct or the shape is perfect, it the people that flew, drove, sailed and there stories that are much more important than the minute details. So I build for the fun of it.

 

Dave

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"I am not trying to open a can of worms here, but, our models are supposed to be scale representations of the real thing".....

 

Tom (and all): And I'm not trying to be cantakerous, but says who?? If that's your criteria, fine. And yes, there is a lot of debate, and a lot of aftermarket out there, and a lot of discussion on what's "right" and what's "wrong". (Go read my rant in the A/C section which discusses that). You're implying that your criteria should apply to the whole hobby of plastic model building, and THAT is what I disagree with.

 

I build models to have a historical representaive on my shelf. If they're less than 100% "accurate" it doesn't matter to me. Other people build for their own reasons and to their own criteria. That's the difference between this being a hobby and a profession. Heck, even contests don't require accuracy! I'm sure that most of the very impressive models I've seen at shows are accurate but I can't judge that for sure.

 

I've seen some REALLY nice models in the hypothetical and "what if" categories. Some of them had spurious paint schemes and others were products of the builder's imagination and spare parts! Those well built and well finished models in those categories were in NO way diminished or any less impressive because of their "inaccuracies".

 

You asked a paint question. I tried to point out something I thought you might not have considered (scale effect), tried to point out that a LOT of accuracy is actually in the eye of the beholder, and then told you why I could not recommend any single brand over another.

 

I wish you the best of luck in finding some paint that you're happy with. I too like Humbrol, but gave up on using it much long ago because of it's lack of availability, so I understand your delimma. Cheers!

 

GIL :smiley16:

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If you build a 1/72 scale model of a Bf 109E-3 it is a scale representation of the real plane. It is not my criteria or anyone elses critera it is a fact. I was not talking about what someones flight of fancy of something they made up. I am not going to say anymore on the subject. Everyone has there opinions and I am not trying to change them.

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Modelmasters RLM 70 and 71 SUCK for accuracy, their no where near close.

 

Since you use enamels I would suggest looking at the Floquil Railroad line of paints.

 

"Pullman Green" is a dead match for RLM 71, I use it myself, I also have a stash of the old Aeromaster enamels and have compared the 2. Their are so close I did a 1/72nd Emil years ago and won around R-4 with 1 wing using the aeromaster and the other using the Pullman Green :D

 

RLM 70 the closest match in Floquils railroad line is "Brunswick Green". this isn't a dead on match but it was going to be workable with some tinting.....till Roll Models found a stash of Aeromaster on the shelfs and I bought 20 bottles of the stuff :D

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  • 4 weeks later...

According to the SAM Publications Datafiles on the -109, they say that ModelMaster #2025 Marine Corps Green FS 344052 is a very close match to RLM 71. I've tried it and agree. They also used the MC Green with ModelMaster #2040 Aircraft Interior Black FS 37031 in a 50/50 ratio to make the RLM 70.

 

I have used Xtracolour enamels in those colours and they are great. Use them if you can get them.

 

I hope that this info helps.

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